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Discussion starter · #22 · (Edited)
Uh, that video shows 379 HP with stock exhaust. Infiniti claims 400 HP on the Q50 Red Sport
Yes. Infiniti is claiming 400 crank horsepower for the Red Sport. Dyno's are showing ~375 - 380 horsepower at the wheels. There is ~15% rule for parasitic drive-train loss of power at the crank to the wheels for all vehicles. (And mind you, this was done on dyno's in California where they only have 91 octane gas, and not the recommended 93.) Taking that in to account, the Red Sport is making upwards to 440 crank horsepower and , not the 400hp claimed by Infiniti.

Same story for the 3.0t (dyno in Cali using 91 octane produced ~300 wheel horsepower, or around 340 crank horsepower) and 2.0t (210 wheel horsepower, or around 240 crank horsepower...).

Which brings us back to the linked article in the OP, they were able to produce 310whp and 325 lb-ft/tq at the wheels using 92 octane. How much more can be extracted if the car is dyno'd using 93 octane...now granted, no two dyno's are likely to yield the same results...but it is clear that all three engines are factory underrated.
 
Yes. Infiniti is claiming 400 crank horsepower for the Red Sport. Dyno's are showing ~375 - 380 horsepower at the wheels. There is ~15% rule for parasitic drive-train loss of power at the crank to the wheels for all vehicles. (And mind you, this was done on dyno's in California where they only have 91 octane gas, and not the recommended 93.) Taking that in to account, the Red Sport is making upwards to 440 crank horsepower and , not the 400hp claimed by Infiniti.

Same story for the 3.0t (dyno in Cali using 91 octane produced ~300 wheel horsepower, or around 340 crank horsepower) and 2.0t (210 wheel horsepower, or around 240 crank horsepower...).

Which brings us back to the linked article in the OP, they were able to produce 310whp and 325 lb-ft/tq at the wheels using 92 octane. How much more can be extracted if the car is dyno'd using 93 octane...now granted, no two dyno's are likely to yield the same results...but it is clear that all three engines are factory underrated.
That's all fine and good, but if you find a dyno test that shows more than 400HP for a stock RS, I'd certainly be interested in seeing it.
 
Discussion starter · #24 ·
That's all fine and good, but if you find a dyno test that shows more than 400HP for a stock RS, I'd certainly be interested in seeing it.
I'll be interested in that as well...

However, unless someone is willing to break the engine out from the car, and test it that way, we'll be hard-pressed to find the true power output. Thus, all we have to rely on are dyno's and the general drive-train loss rule to guestimate true engine power, registered at the wheels.
 
I'll be interested in that as well...

However, unless someone is willing to break the engine out from the car, and test it that way, we'll be hard-pressed to find the true power output. Thus, all we have to rely on are dyno's and the general drive-train loss rule to guestimate true engine power, registered at the wheels.
Ok, so no one has posted dyno results of more than 400HP stock.
 
There is ~15% rule for parasitic drive-train loss of power at the crank to the wheels for all vehicles.
One of the first things I learned from reading these papers was to completely disregard the 15 percent drivetrain loss "rule" (or any other percent value) that so often comes up during online discussions of whp versus net horsepower. The fact of the matter is every vehicle experiences different levels of drivetrain loss as determined by the design of its transmission and driveline components. Simply put, the amount of horsepower lost to the forces of inertia, drag, windage, pumping and friction are different for every engine, transmission and driveline design.
Drivetrain Power Loss - The 15% "Rule"- Modified Magazine
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
Ok, so no one has posted dyno results of more than 400HP stock.
No.

And yes, there is a "but". That doesn't change the assessment that the engine is producing more power than what the company is claiming.

I get it...conversely, BMW claims the B58 engine in the 340i is making 320 hp. Dyno's actually showed that the car produces ~339 horsepower at the wheels, or about 380 at the crank. I imagine this fits your definition of being underrated?

No matter what the respective companies have claimed, dyno's show that both companies' engines are underrated. And unlike the Red Sport, the 3.0t and 2.0t dyno's show more hp at the wheels, than the claimed hp by Infiniti (and Mercedes).

I don't think it's too far-fetched to assess that the RS engine is producing more than what is claimed. After all, it's the same engine that appeared in the Q80 Inspiration Concept. Infiniti claims 550hp for that car, with a 100hp of that claim is hybrid-assisted.
 
Discussion starter · #28 ·
No.

And yes, there is a "but". That doesn't change the assessment that the engine is producing more power than what the company is claiming.

I get it...conversely, BMW claims the B58 engine in the 340i is making 320 hp. Dyno's actually showed that the car produces ~339 horsepower at the wheels, or about 380 at the crank. I imagine this fits your definition of being underrated?

No matter what the respective companies have claimed, dyno's show that both companies' engines are underrated. And unlike the Red Sport, the 3.0t and 2.0t dyno's show more hp at the wheels, than the claimed hp by Infiniti (and Mercedes).

I don't think it's too far-fetched to assess that the RS engine is producing more than what is claimed. After all, it's the same engine that appeared in the Q80 Inspiration Concept. Infiniti claims 550hp for that car, with a 100hp of that claim is hybrid-assisted.
Again, that's all fine and good but just because a Q60 3.0T Produced 310whp (see OP) doesn't mean the RS is going to produce 400+whp
 
Discussion starter · #31 ·
Again, that's all fine and good but just because a Q60 3.0T Produced 310whp (see OP) doesn't mean the RS is going to produce 400+whp
Unless I completely misread/or simply misunderstood your previous posts in this thread, I never mentioned, or don't remember others who mentioned that the RS made 400+ whp. I can see how it could be deduced from my recent post... I mentioned that the RS engine is underrated in that it has been assess to produce more than 400 crank horsepower, based on the horsepower results at the wheels.

It would be nice though to see some stock dyno runs of a 2017 Q60...
There's a youtube video from Fast Intentions where they did a stock dyno run on a Q60 3.0t, before installing their exhaust.

There is also a video in the linked OP article as well...is it more you are looking for?
 
Unless I completely misread/or simply misunderstood your previous posts in this thread, I never mentioned, or don't remember others who mentioned that the RS made 400+ whp. I can see how it could be deduced from my recent post... I mentioned that the RS engine is underrated in that it has been assess to produce more than 400 crank horsepower, based on the horsepower results at the wheels.
My replies were based on the OP and this reply:
Multiple Q50 3.0t and RS400 owners have put their cars on dynos and all have confirmed the cars put down more than advertised. Definitely underrated by Infiniti. Perhaps it's a marketing gimmick of having vehicles that produce exactly 300 and 400 horsepower.
Now obviously the dynos are measuring whp. Unless someone is getting more than 400 whp on a dyno, they're assuming they're getting more than 400hp at the crank.
 
Show us your proof the Q50/Q60 RS & 3.0t lose less than 15% hp from parasitic loss
I have none. They could lose even more. For all I know the RS produces 500 at the crank. H-e-l-l, Infiniti might be publishing HP numbers from the wheel. I know this, there are dyno results that show 310 from a Q60 3.0t Premium and 379 from a Q50 Red Sport. Looks like the 300 HP buyers are getting a bargain and the 400 HP buyers are getting cheated.

If you find any legit crank numbers I'd like to see those as well :D
 
Discussion starter · #36 ·
I have none. They could lose even more. For all I know the RS produces 500 at the crank. H-e-l-l, Infiniti might be publishing HP numbers from the wheel. I know this, there are dyno results that show 310 from a Q60 3.0t Premium and 379 from a Q50 Red Sport. Looks like the 300 HP buyers are getting a bargain and the 400 HP buyers are getting cheated.

If you find any legit crank numbers I'd like to see those as well :D
That's a matter of perspective...

At this point, info has been presented to you from what some of the reputable industry tuners have assessed. It's not incumbent on any of us to shoulder a burden of proof for you, to what they've assessed. That's fine you don't have to subscribe to it. ;)
 
That's a matter of perspective...

At this point, info has been presented to you from what some of the reputable industry tuners have assessed. It's not incumbent on any of us to shoulder a burden of proof for you, to what they've assessed. That's fine you don't have to subscribe to it. ;)
:laugh:
Uh, where's the proof that my 2017 Q60 RS has more than 400 HP at the crank? :p
 
Concept Z Performance posted this today about the RS...

"We tested our brand new Q60 RS 400 on our Mustang Dyno! It put down 354whp and 353ft-lb of torque, which puts it at around 420-450hp at the crank. Infiniti is severely under-rating these from the factory! Expect to see about 370whp on DynoJets and DynaPacks."

 
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